Gain extra benefits by becoming a Supporting Member Click here find out how!
Silver
Gold ***Platinum***
Jax ChevysRadar1270BelAirHT (11)1960 Apache 40vet65b (5)
cdandelivery (11)orod (5)frame304dr 57 (7)marmst64 Aldo Lorenzo
Sgt._Grumpy (11)Henrys57wagon (9)Radar12Mosa1976drshock (4)
RoadRockerSoCal52Deluxe
ForeverYoung (5)
Mike JW (3)
kerryd8 (8)
Panama Red (5)
Jerry Acheson (12)
Classic Performance Products Classic Parts
Ciadella Interiors American Auto Wire Art Morrison.com
Exile® Battery Keeper™ 6/12 volt charger w/ LED battery monitor
Low priced Genuine GM Auto PartsEcklers AutoMotive
Hellwig Products IncPerformance Rod & CustomClassic Industries
Impala Bob's Bob's Chevy Trucks Bob's Chevelle Parts Bob's Classic Chevy
 
 

Recent Hot Topics
Current Quote
"I have noticed that there are tons of requests for help from all over the place me included and I would just like to give a big thanks to all the people who keep this up and going and are there to help us all out learning about some of these things."
~ New Member
Recent Topics
Join the Community today







Username Post: lifter noise        (Topic#185060)
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-19-08 12:45 PM - Post#1392002    

OK guys this is a bit long but I need some help.

I have a BB 73 chevelle with the original engine and everytime I start it up again after it's hot I have a loud lifter noise. Embarassing leaving a car show after a few hours with a lifter taping away.

Decided that I'd get new chevy lifters and change the old ones. When I got the intake off and pulled the lifters I could see that 2 lobes of the cam didn't look right so I pulled the cam and replaced it with a crane cam with the same specs as my LS4. Since the car is all original I wanted to keep it that way.

So I changed the cam and lifters and everything went smooth and it started right up and ran fine. The next day I changed the oil and ran it again and shut it down and waited for an hour or so and the lifter is banging away again. Not happy!

Seems everytime I bet the car hot and the restart it in an hour or 2 the lifter starts banging. I brought the car down to a local mechanic who knows the car and works and races big block and he can't believe I have the same problem. He seems to think maybe it's a valve guide or a rocker are.

Any thoughts???

 
strokersix 
Senior Member
Posts: 1041

Reg: 04-05-03
03-19-08 01:01 PM - Post#1392020    
    In response to Finajoe

Try to determine which side of the engine it's coming from and remove that valve cover. Lay your finger on each rocker while the engine is idling. You will probably be able to feel which one is tapping. I'll bet it's a rocker arm, pushrod, or guideplate issue. While you are at it, clean off the upper area of the pushrods and put a paint pen mark on each pushrod. That will give you a quick visual whether they are spinning like they should. They may not all spin at idle but as long as they spin when you rev it up that's a good indication that the lifters are spinning properly.
69 Caprice 454 TH400 (original 427 in storage) 72 Nova 410 big block 3 speed Saginaw (was 306" inline six)


 
55chevy383 
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1306
55chevy383
Age: 46
Loc: Noble, Ok.
Reg: 12-08-05
03-19-08 02:06 PM - Post#1392051    
    In response to strokersix

Are you using stock lifters? If so did you change the retaining nut for the lifters, or re-use the old ones? If you reused the old ones, you may have one that's not staying tight and it's backing off and letting the lifter tap.

Phil
11.66 @ 115 N/A.
Phil's '55


 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-19-08 02:17 PM - Post#1392058    
    In response to 55chevy383

  • 55chevy383 Said:
Are you using stock lifters? If so did you change the retaining nut for the lifters, or re-use the old ones? If you reused the old ones, you may have one that's not staying tight and it's backing off and letting the lifter tap.

Phil



Phil, I reused all the old stuff but the lifter makes noise only at certain times. I can understand it backing off but it would make noise all the time if that were the case.

Thanks


 
MikeB 
Senior Member
Posts: 9521
MikeB
Loc: Plano, TX
Reg: 08-28-03
03-19-08 03:47 PM - Post#1392118    
    In response to Finajoe

Does it make noise for only a few seconds after start-up? How much preload do you have on the lifters (turns past zero lash)?

1982 C-10 SWB pickup -- Unmolested, original paint, 250 six, 3-on-the-tree
(Soon to be 350 w/Vortec heads & TH350)

Sold my 55 sedan in June 2014, having owned it 11 years.


 
Vaughn 
"13th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 15703

Loc: Colorado Springs, CO
Reg: 08-08-04
03-19-08 04:13 PM - Post#1392135    
    In response to MikeB

There is a hole drilled into the lifter valley cap on the front of the block, behind the timing chain. This hole lube the timing chain and sprockets. It also bleeds air out of the end of the lifter galley. If this hole was/is plugged, it can cause lifter noise during startup.

There are also BBC blocks that have a tendency to bleed down oil pressure when sitting. There are oil filters out there that have a one way valve in them to prevent this oil system bleed down. If I were you, I would try this style of filter first to see if it fixed your problem.

Someone here probably has the Fram number for the filter.

 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-19-08 05:36 PM - Post#1392202    
    In response to Vaughn

MikeB, I have 1/2 turn lash on the lifters.
Which is what Crane says is correct.

Vaughn, I used a wix racing filter with this feature and VR1 oil and EOS.

The lifter that makes the noise only does it after the car is run to full temperture and then sits for a while. When I start it up then the lifter clacks as the one I took out did. This goes on for about 5 to 8 minutes and then goes away. The reason I did the job is to get rid of this problem. Seems like I did this whole job for nothing.

Strokersix, I hope that your right that it's a rocker arm, guide plate or push rod. I rule out the push rod because I checked them all out when I did the job. Now I have to find out which lifter is doing it and change the guide plate and the rocker. Do you think it could be a valve guide, I sure hope not, don't want to take the whole thing apart again.

 
74elco for73SS 
Senior Member
Posts: 575
74elco for73SS
Loc: so cal
Reg: 04-30-04
03-19-08 08:43 PM - Post#1392319    
    In response to Finajoe

also you could try moving switching the rocker arm assembly from one valve to another valve and see if the noise goes with it.

 
55chevy383 
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1306
55chevy383
Age: 46
Loc: Noble, Ok.
Reg: 12-08-05
03-20-08 04:09 AM - Post#1392409    
    In response to 74elco for73SS

I can't see a rocker arm being the sole cause of the noise, unless it's always loose, which would bring me back the retaining nut. Maybe a bad lifter bore and a lifter is hangin' up?

Phil
11.66 @ 115 N/A.
Phil's '55


 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-20-08 06:18 AM - Post#1392480    
    In response to 55chevy383

  • 55chevy383 Said:
I can't see a rocker arm being the sole cause of the noise, unless it's always loose, which would bring me back the retaining nut. Maybe a bad lifter bore and a lifter is hangin' up?

Phil



I agree that this was one of the things I was thinking about. But when I put the cam in the old lifters cam out very easy and none of them were hung up. Also the new ones just slid right in with no problems. This is making me nuts because I don't see anything wrong. I checked the push rods and the rockers and didn't see anything. I think I have to pull of the valve cover and check the spinning of the push rods.


 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-26-08 03:29 PM - Post#1397273    
    In response to Finajoe

OK, so far not much luck but here's where I stand.

I brought the car down to a guy who know's big blocks and he's had it for a few days now. He can't seem to find much but the noise continues. It seems that theres not much oil coming up to the rocker arms. Has anyone drilled bigger holes in the stock rocker arms to let more oil up?

Seems the hole in the rocker is off to the side and the puchrods don't line up with this hole. A few of the rockers are getting oil but most are not. We checked the ball in the rockers and one of them is worn and the rocker is a darker color than the others.

We checked the oil pressure and it was at 50 lbs. Any reason why oil would not get up to the rockers?

Since the new lifters have a groove toward the bottom is it possible that the lifter on the low part of the cam is loosing oil as the lifter groove is going lower than the bore.



 
Vaughn 
"13th Year" Gold Supporting Member
Posts: 15703

Loc: Colorado Springs, CO
Reg: 08-08-04
03-26-08 04:52 PM - Post#1397333    
    In response to Finajoe

Try installing different distributor bases.

The distributor base fits into the right hand oil galley, if it isn't a tight fit you may have oiling issues on the top end (although usually the indicated oil pressure is lower). I have seen this happen a couple of times on SBCs, so I assume that it could also be the case with the BBC.

Some newer aftermarket distributors go so far as to O-ring the distributor base to eliminate leakage from this point.

 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-26-08 05:15 PM - Post#1397349    
    In response to Vaughn

Vaughn, thanks for the reply.

We did use another dist which was designed for a drill to run oil pressure. The oil pressure was about the same with the drill.

Seems we have oil at the lifters but it's not coming up to the rockers.

What about drilling larger holes in the rockers? Or maybe using new ones to see what happens.

 
motorman 
Dedicated Enthusiast
Posts: 5177

Loc: south western pa.
Reg: 01-25-00
03-26-08 07:22 PM - Post#1397450    
    In response to Finajoe

i have heard other people with the same problem with crane hyd lifters some bleed down after setting. there is a fellow over on the NCRS board with the same problem. my advice try another brand of lifter.
retired race engine builder,former NASCAR tech inspector. new corvettes owned 1959,1962,1963,1964,1965, 1966,1997,1999,2002,2005, 2008 plus 30+ other chevy cars and trucks along the way. 2008 corvette sold and waiting on a C-7.


Edited by motorman on 03-26-08 07:22 PM. Reason for edit: No reason given.

 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-26-08 07:51 PM - Post#1397470    
    In response to motorman

motorman, I didn't use Crane lifters. I purchased GM original lifters and used a Crane cam.

 
55chevy383 
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1306
55chevy383
Age: 46
Loc: Noble, Ok.
Reg: 12-08-05
03-27-08 04:11 AM - Post#1397591    
    In response to Finajoe

Is it just one or both sides not getting oil to the rockers?
11.66 @ 115 N/A.
Phil's '55


 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-27-08 05:36 AM - Post#1397641    
    In response to 55chevy383

  • 55chevy383 Said:
Is it just one or both sides not getting oil to the rockers?



Both sides, yet some oil is coming up to a few of the rockers on both sides. It's very light and not squirting on any of them.

 
55chevy383 
Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 1306
55chevy383
Age: 46
Loc: Noble, Ok.
Reg: 12-08-05
03-27-08 01:13 PM - Post#1397993    
    In response to Finajoe

Possible bad oil pump, or clogged oil passage?

Phil
11.66 @ 115 N/A.
Phil's '55


 
strokersix 
Senior Member
Posts: 1041

Reg: 04-05-03
03-27-08 04:10 PM - Post#1398107    
    In response to 55chevy383

I think you've found your problem:

"We checked the ball in the rockers and one of them is worn and the rocker is a darker color than the others."
69 Caprice 454 TH400 (original 427 in storage) 72 Nova 410 big block 3 speed Saginaw (was 306" inline six)


 
Finajoe 
Member
Posts: 304

Loc: Florida
Reg: 07-01-04
03-27-08 04:25 PM - Post#1398115    
    In response to strokersix

This motor is original and has never been apart. When I spoke with the original owner about 8 years ago I asked him about the lifter problem and he said it has done it since new. I figured once I changed the cam and lifters that would do it but the problem continued.

Today we replaced one of the rockers with a used rocker the mechanic had at the shop. Within a minute or so oil came up and was running like a river yet the other rockers were dry. We replaced the rockers on one side of the motor and the oil was running all over the place. Tomorrow he's going to replace the other side rockers and put the covers on and let it heat up. Then wait an hour and see if the lifter clacks. I feel pretty good that the problem is solved but I'll know more tomorrow.

The most amazing thing is the rockers don't look any different than the ones we put on. Must be some type of problem with the BB 73 motors because all the rockers are the original ones.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that this is it.

 
whitedj 
"2nd Year Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 288
whitedj
Loc: Jacksonville, NC
Reg: 11-16-03
03-31-08 02:44 PM - Post#1400788    
    In response to Finajoe

Did the new rocker arms stop the clattering on both sides? I am interested, as I have a 454 with the same exact problem.
David
Some people live an entire lifetime and wonder if they have made a difference to the world, but the Marines don't have that problem. Ronald Reagan


 
hot rod resto 
Forum Newbie
Posts: 1

Reg: 07-11-11
07-11-11 02:43 AM - Post#2112862    
    In response to Finajoe

did you ever figure out that lifter problem it seems im having the same problem and cant figure it out

 
al72 
"5th Year" Silver Supporting Member
Posts: 239

Loc: Michigan
Reg: 11-05-08
07-11-11 04:23 AM - Post#2112875    
    In response to hot rod resto

I also have a stock 454 from a 1974 GMC 3/4 ton with the identical rocker arm oiling problem.

 
Jims56chevy 
Frequent Contributor
Posts: 2226
Jims56chevy
Loc: chino valley az
Reg: 11-23-04
07-29-11 09:46 AM - Post#2119354    
    In response to Finajoe

How can a rocker arm increase oil pressure???
56 210 2dr


 
Icon Legend Permissions Topic Options
Report Post

Quote Post

Quick Reply

Print Topic

Email Topic

11771 Views
FusionBB
FusionBB™ Version 2.1
©2003-2006 InteractivePHP, Inc.
Execution time: 0.096 seconds.   Total Queries: 14   Zlib Compression is on.
All times are (GMT -0800) Pacific. Current time is 05:39 AM
Top